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Is growing an unconscious body legal?

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Posted 29 days ago , edited 28 days ago
As topic suggested, sorry to people in a vegetative state, I am not referring to them
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Posted 29 days ago , edited 28 days ago
It is not, every cell cultive that you can think of is by definition unconscious. Thing is, we still don't have the technology to create and grow all the organs so it can only be worked by parts.
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Posted 29 days ago , edited 29 days ago

DrowSorcerer wrote:

It is not, every cell cultive that you can think of is by definition unconscious. Thing is, we still don't have the technology to create and grow all the organs so it can only be worked by parts.


You are not piecing body parts together like a frankenstein. You are essentially growing one from an embryo outside. Please check out this video if you are not grossed out by a chicken embryo, I assure you it is rewarding. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uE0uKvUbcfw

I believe human can be grown in the same way with the only difference of inhibiting the consciousness from growing, meaning you somehow rewire the gene expression in the brain with a optogenetic tweezer and turn off the consciousness from developing. And there you get an empty human body.
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Posted 29 days ago , edited 28 days ago
Yeah, and I'm talking about what is possible with the tech we have now (and we are aware of), beliefs are irrelevant in that regard.
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Posted 29 days ago , edited 29 days ago

DrowSorcerer wrote:

Yeah, and I'm talking about what is possible with the tech we have now (and we are aware of), beliefs are irrelevant in that regard.


Well to create a human embryo you put a fertilized egg inside the egg white in a similar fashion and pump it with oxygen.
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Posted 29 days ago , edited 28 days ago
Unconscious is the operative word here, and you need to start with the definition of unconsciousness you search. Zero brain activity? Only cerebellum functions?
Supposing this would be connected to the question you put somewhere else about uploading your consciousness to an unconscious body, you will face a second problem. Consciousness (as an expression of individual identity) is pretty much a physical property of the brain, determined by the way in which a net of synapses has been defined geometrically and polished over time to work in a particular way. Therefore, it is deeply intertwined with your basic brain functions. How you create a body without consciousness but with a fully developed brain? Well, you can't, unless you decide to keep it in a deep induced coma but then it would be highly unethical and most likely illegal asi t can count as a form of torture or Imprisonment. Then, supposing you can force a brain to take. The shape of another brain, it will most likely be an imperfect copy, so the one copied might not be you.
Then, again, talking about a genetic switch to turn consciousness off from developing it's... Well, naive. Genes do not work that way.
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Posted 29 days ago , edited 29 days ago

DrowSorcerer wrote:

Unconscious is the operative word here, and you need to start with the definition of unconsciousness you search. Zero brain activity? Only cerebellum functions?
Supposing this would be connected to the question you put somewhere else about uploading your consciousness to an unconscious body, you will face a second problem. Consciousness (as an expression of individual identity) is pretty much a physical property of the brain, determined by the way in which a net of synapses has been defined geometrically and polished over time to work in a particular way. Therefore, it is deeply intertwined with your basic brain functions. How you create a body without consciousness but with a fully developed brain? Well, you can't, unless you decide to keep it in a deep induced coma but then it would be highly unethical and most likely illegal asi t can count as a form of torture or Imprisonment. Then, supposing you can force a brain to take. The shape of another brain, it will most likely be an imperfect copy, so the one copied might not be you.
Then, again, talking about a genetic switch to turn consciousness off from developing it's... Well, naive. Genes do not work that way.


Right you've probably heard of the term over expression and lower expression. Just because we can create induced pluripotent stem cell does not mean we changed its genetics.

Scientists have pinpointed the region of consciousness to pointine tengentum, specifically that in the brain stem.
https://www.sciencealert.com/harvard-scientists-think-they-ve-pinpointed-the-neural-source-of-consciousness

P.S. Of course I wouldn't know the synaptic delays of an unconscious pointine tengentum region, I'll have scientists figure that out for me.
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Posted 29 days ago , edited 28 days ago
And yet, block the expression of consciousness as we know it does not imply not consciousness in exactly the way you want it. There are a couple of logical and causality flaws in your argument
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Posted 29 days ago , edited 28 days ago

DrowSorcerer wrote:

And yet, block the expression of consciousness as we know it does not imply not consciousness in exactly the way you want it. There are a couple of logical and causality flaws in your argument


Depends on how you define unconscious
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Posted 29 days ago , edited 28 days ago
-sigh- thing I already asked two posts before and you haven't been able to answer....
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Posted 29 days ago , edited 29 days ago

DrowSorcerer wrote:

-sigh- thing I already asked two posts before and you haven't been able to answer....


Sorry my friend, I do not have an answer. A spherical neurons all with a synaptic delay of 1 ms for all of them might imply non consciousness. As long as it does not produce a life like signals. Same thing for my chair and my computer, and my boxer, we use our best estimate
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Posted 29 days ago , edited 28 days ago
Then maybe an admin should move this to chit chat since it's not a real discussion
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Posted 29 days ago , edited 29 days ago

DrowSorcerer wrote:

Then maybe an admin should move this to chit chat since it's not a real discussion


Sure mod, you can move this to chit chat so the above user can go finding intelligence .

P.S.
A. I am not a spy, I buy my own pizza.
B. No religious involvement of any kind.
C. Follow my sayings and you could be rewarded, no offense.
D. Sorry, I am not at war with Italy.
E. Did you find the chicken embryo offensive?
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Posted 29 days ago , edited 28 days ago
Final comment as I thought this could be interesting but ended being a nonsensical, pointless loss of time
A. I never even considered that so I don't give a damn and good for you.
B. Irrelevant, non connected to the topic nor to the conversation. Again do not give a single f**k
C. With this morning I had enough pointless mumbo jumbo without much of a honest interest on an actual conversation. I'll follow my own path, thank you.
D. Me neither. Again, a pointless remark
E. Nope, it really was interesting. The music was trash tho. xD
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Posted 29 days ago , edited 29 days ago

DrowSorcerer wrote:

Final comment as I thought this could be interesting but ended being a nonsensical, pointless loss of time
A. I never even considered that so I don't give a damn and good for you.
B. Irrelevant, non connected to the topic nor to the conversation. Again do not give a single f**k
C. With this morning I had enough pointless mumbo jumbo without much of a honest interest on an actual conversation. I'll follow my own path, thank you.
D. Me neither. Again, a pointless remark
E. Nope, it really was interesting. The music was trash tho. xD



Sigh, yes as you've mentioned. Consciousness is a resonance generated by a particular geometric shape of the neurons. As to how and why? Nope I am not a neuroscientist. One thing I know is it is in the brain, and it is in the pointine tegentume region in the brain stem. I applaud myself for getting this far because I always thought it is in the cerebellum.

Now you lead me in to some philosophical stuff = =. Can I prove anything conscious? No not exactly, again best estimate. Is water conscious, I wouldn't know. It seems you are asking me to be unable to make a conjecture. I find that pointless. Anything that does not exhibit a life sign, a generation of signal of its own, is not recognized as conscious to me.

Yes forgive me for bringing up such a topic. Growing a body, even in an incubator would be a borderline ethical topic, not to mention without a brain. And if I want to dwell into legality I'd probably ask a lawyer myself with a law degree, not philosophy, no offense.

Yes there are crazy neuroscientists aiming intricate optogenetic laser at my brain at night, I guess? I don't know who they are and I am sort of curious to find out.

Yes I am at war with another group that sort of just take the credit for their own after falsifying everything I've said, since day one. I can/cannot get mad and I can/cannot blame the team rocket.
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